Tank Mechanics/Gameplay

[salmanfla]

i played this game from 2013 and starting over this 2020. i think there is so much changes in the game

what i know from past luna or other RPG/MMORPG games, the Tank role is supposed to "tank" the enemy/monster and other party member supposed to hit the mobs with decent damage while the Tank lack of it. but today P.Deff 22k isnt even could mob 20 maggot in garden, because of the latest mechanic how P.Deff works and add Block Percentage. its so sad i think the games changes so much, but maybe its for balancing between other job in other use like PvP/PvE

people (105-150) leveling with boost, not leveling together partying. I know its the right for others to spend their money into whatever they want, but what makes it fun? 

and people only care for themselves claiming monster spot all-alone im not blaming the farmer job, but why we only can farm with "the only farming job" (if you know what i mean), why not make other jobs capable to farm

Its peoples right to be individualistic or not, but i think its more fun when we can play together, partying etc

sorry for the messy thread and english language, its my first thread here Thanks

[virlya]

i agree with you, i am pretty shock too, after play again at 2020, for player that love to be tank this is the worst. 

seem luna plus has same system and the monster at normal field can't be kill anymore, dungeon dungeon and dungeon. maybe they want to make the system similiar with that.

 

for the play style, you are right no more party with tank, they can't handle their job, there no party at NH, GG, Grav. yeah, something must be happen when we vacuum from this game.

[virlya]

for now i only can hope for the update, but i am not give up, i am trying to make tanker that can handle the mob. combine def, block rate and eva. idk this will success or not but ill try.

[Orange]

You will never get enough evasion as a fighter tank so instead worry about HP, HP recovery and block and stop thinking that you should be able to tank 20 monsters without any potions or healing.

[SilverDeer]

I'm not against the minimal damage, it sounds unrealistic to tank half the map and still take 1 damage. I'm just against how it affects the purpose of the "Shield barrier" skill, you're in trouble and a 15-seconds buff that's supposed to protect you with strong defense power up doesn't help at all. (I once made a suggestion about this problem)

[virlya]

can it be the damage increase base on how many monster that attack us? if only 1-5 or 1-10 monster it still 1 damage, more than 11 they do more damage or something like that?

i believe luna plus use that system at def and eva, maybe can be apply at this too. it is not about comparing the system, but seem that a good.

[salmanfla]

3 hours ago, SilverDeer said:

I'm not against the minimal damage, it sounds unrealistic to tank half the map and still take 1 damage. I'm just against how it affects the purpose of the "Shield barrier" skill, you're in trouble and a 15-seconds buff that's supposed to protect you with strong defense power up doesn't help at all. (I once made a suggestion about this problem)

This mechanics renders shield barrier skills useless because of minimum damage, i agree with you

and this affects P.Deff completely Useless too, if your character doesn't have high blockrate, the damage from monster will be the same between 8500 P.Deff player and 22000 P.Deff player on the same level

if P.Deff Useless, then Tank Mage are not good as before because tank mage doesnt have block and have maybe lower P.Deff/HP than Tank Fighter.

the effect is people are not willing to build mage anymore, 

and newer/older comeback player will create "that farming job" again and again

 

but for the tank half of the map its the way "Tank Job" farm so the farming method may vary in this game, people with tank jobs will do "tank" and party because of its low damage output. not only the throwbombers dominating the map every channel.

maybe better to add the percentage of the blocking for every skills, items, etc and add that skills for mage jobs or remove the minimum damage system,

thanks

[salmanfla]

4 hours ago, Orange said:

You will never get enough evasion as a fighter tank so instead worry about HP, HP recovery and block and stop thinking that you should be able to tank 20 monsters without any potions or healing.

so the stat needed for tank is changed from P.Deff into evasion..

well.. then all Rogue job player are OP because it has good damage output/critical and good tank stat (eva) with same price/value per equipment spent

[Orange]

Yes, rogue is overpowered right now, for that reason we will be looking at critical damage reformulation and capping evasion so that you can't evade all attacks all the time.

[salmanfla]

10 hours ago, Orange said:

Yes, rogue is overpowered right now, for that reason we will be looking at critical damage reformulation and capping evasion so that you can't evade all attacks all the time.

ok i think that is the right solution to be implemented for balancing between jobs. because its very unfair when you have high eva, you can mob 100 monster without getting hit, but when you have high P.Deff you cant even mob 20 monster.

i hope the system/mechanics fixed as soon as possible or turn back the old one (P.Deff more than P.Attack always becomes 1 damage)

[jokerjoker]

I think how tank and def work is good for now. Tank should be still taking damage from monster. This will enable healer in a party.

What need to be done is either nerfing damage PVE or make the monster harder.

If its possible make it even full geared player (include using donation item) still cant one hit monster. Hitter should stay as hitter, they shouldnt able fully mob monster whether its using eva/def. This mean hitter has to take heavy damage from monster if he is hunt alone. So If we want hunt we need atleast 3 people in party (hitter, tank, healer).

[salmanfla]

3 hours ago, jokerjoker said:

Tank should be still taking damage from monster.

but if you look at rogue eva, eva can't even taking damage from monster at all,  its very unfair in the game, when rogue with good eva can mobs up to 50 monster without getting hit but fighter/mage with high P.Deff cant even mobs 20 monster 

The conclusion is to be a tank in this game, eva isi needed, not P.Deff

and its renders all P.Deff job with lesser damage useless.

please consider to fix the mechanics of P.Deff. so all jobs can farming with their own way, or maybe admin only wants Entrap job to be specialized for farming

[Orange]

20 minutes ago, salmanfla said:

but if you look at rogue eva, eva can't even taking damage from monster at all,  its very unfair in the game, when rogue with good eva can mobs up to 50 monster without getting hit but fighter/mage with high P.Deff cant even mobs 20 monster 

The conclusion is to be a tank in this game, eva isi needed, not P.Deff

and its renders all P.Deff job with lesser damage useless.

please consider to fix the mechanics of P.Deff. so all jobs can farming with their own way, or maybe admin only wants Entrap job to be specialized for farming

No, Pdef is perfect where it is, we will fix evasion and critical damage.

[Antoni77]

physical defend is balanced because long time ago, we can tank even a 15 level higher monster than us and still get 1 damages (not bosses), I remember that time I still Paladin level 106, using +13 Kynee, and +12 full Set Holy Iron Chain, +7 Aias Shield, Chival, 2 Hator ViT, 2 Earing VIT, getting around 7k - 8k Physical Def, and I can tanking Ghost Knight and Esquire on Graveyard... lvl 106 can tanking lvl 120 monsters, really bro? xD

hmm and yes about evasion limitation, how about we make 6 mobs only at max, if more than that, we will took the damages from the 7th enemy or more enemies? (just want to share what on my mind only) >w<

[SilverDeer]

7 hours ago, Antoni77 said:

physical defend is balanced because long time ago, we can tank even a 15 level higher monster than us and still get 1 damages (not bosses), I remember that time I still Paladin level 106, using +13 Kynee, and +12 full Set Holy Iron Chain, +7 Aias Shield, Chival, 2 Hator ViT, 2 Earing VIT, getting around 7k - 8k Physical Def, and I can tanking Ghost Knight and Esquire on Graveyard... lvl 106 can tanking lvl 120 monsters, really bro? xD

hmm and yes about evasion limitation, how about we make 6 mobs only at max, if more than that, we will took the damages from the 7th enemy or more enemies? (just want to share what on my mind only) >w<

It's how it works in Luna Plus versions.  If I'm not wrong, the same thing happens with the physical defense, after 6 mobs your defense begins to "decrease" for each one you attract. 

If we use common sense this is how a game should work, it seems unreal to me that people want a mage who attacks like a mage and defends like a paladin, considering it has enough skills to stop monsters.  xD

I only insist with the point I mentioned above (Shield Barrier). Having a lot of defense should give you some block rate or at least the game should give you a little extra defense(%) that should work if your defense is exaggerated compared to the minimal defense you need to get the minimal damage. I mean if you have 10k Pdeff and you start to receive the minimal damage (let's say 100) if you have 20k then the minimal damage should be reduced to 90-80. Otherwise it seems that having a lot of defense is completely useless